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Another Obamacare Lie: ER Visits To Increase, not decrease - Redneck Clubhouse - Of, By and For Rednecks!

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  #1  
Old January 6th, 2014, 08:00 AM
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Default Another Obamacare Lie: ER Visits To Increase, not decrease

And I quote:
Quote:



Among the many lies and untruths told to the American people was one that said Obamacare would cut the number of emergency room visits.* President Obama stood before the nation and told us that more people will be going to doctors’ offices for treatment and that the number of visits to emergency rooms will decrease.

However, according to a study conducted by Harvard University, the number of emergency room visits is going to increase under Obamacare instead of decrease.

In 2008, Oregon expanded its Medicaid program to include more people and a team from Harvard studied what happened.* The state held a lottery to determine who would be allowed to enroll in Medicaid.* The study looked at 25,000 new Medicaid patients in the Portland area over an 18 month period.* The Medicaid enrollees visited emergency rooms for non-emergency issues 1.42 times during the study period and uninsured people only visited the ER 1.02 times.** New Medicaid enrollees made 40% more ER visits than the uninsured.

Based upon what happened in Oregon, Harvard says that the additional 4 million people that are signing up under Medicaid will also seek non-emergency treatment at emergency rooms.

Economist James Smith with the Rand Corp. looked at the Harvard study and referred to it as the ‘gold standard’ for research.* He agrees that Medicaid expansion lead to an increased in emergency room visits, which are more costly than visits to a general practitioners.

Katherine Baicker, co-author of the Harvard study, said that low income people who get enrolled in Medicaid visit emergency rooms for a broad range of issues, many of which could be treated less expensively had the patients visited their primary physician.* However, since ER visits are more costly than office visits, it will add more cost to the price tag of Obamacare.* Baicker added:
"That leaves policymakers with the difficult evaluation of comparing the substantial real costs of the program, with the substantial benefits to enrollees of having the coverage."

So far, only twenty-five states plus the District of Columbia are expanding Medicaid.* Even with just less than half of the states expanding Medicaid enrollment, over 19 million people are expected to sign up for the government subsidized healthcare program.* Don’t forget that 45 states have yet to make 10% of their projected enrollment into Obamacare, so estimates for Medicaid enrollment could be much higher than reality.

The bottom line is that a reduction in emergency rooms visits is just another Obamacare lie told by Obama.* It seems that you can take most of what Obama and Pelosi have said about Obamacare and expect the exact opposite.



The post Another Obamacare Lie: ER Visits To Increase appeared first on Godfather Politics.

  #2  
Old January 6th, 2014, 12:11 PM
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It's not a lie, it's the, the, the..... pretruth.
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  #3  
Old January 6th, 2014, 02:43 PM
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So Obama lied in 2008 because a study done in 2014 predicts different ones than he predicted then?

Listen, there are people out there who are just now forming their opinions on Obamacare. How do you think this would influence their opinions? Most reasonable people understand that when Obama said you could keep your doctor or your plan it should have been obvious to him that that couldn't happen under the proposed bill unless they specifically worded that into the bill. Since he promised it and they didn't, it was a lie and should be called such. But this statement here was obviously a speculation, and a reasonable one at that. If a study shows that it is likely that he was wrong, that doesn't make it a lie. If practical application shows that he was wrong, it still isn't a lie. Why do you feel the need to promote bottom feeder garbage like this that turns off reasonable people who want the facts, not whatever crap you can dig up and spin?
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  #4  
Old January 6th, 2014, 03:55 PM
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Obama, as president, knowing what he says is going to be held up as gospel should have refrained from speculating on the effects of ObamaCare and someone in his administration should have advised against such speculations until practical application was in place and we actually saw how it affected the number of ER visits. Seems like politics 101 to me.
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Old January 6th, 2014, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by lilpogie View Post
Obama, as president, knowing what he says is going to be held up as gospel should have refrained from speculating on the effects of ObamaCare and someone in his administration should have advised against such speculations until practical application was in place and we actually saw how it affected the number of ER visits. Seems like politics 101 to me.
But it is ok for others to speculate about the negative effects? If nobody can make reasonable speculations about what a law is designed to do, then wouldn't Pelosi have the right approach in saying we should just pass laws and see what happens?

The argument that there would be fewer er visits is a sensible one. That doesn't mean it is necessarily correct, but if everyone has insurance over time er visits should go down. A study that covers one year following uninsured people getting insurance isn't really the be all end all word on what the overall affect will be. It would be interesting to me to see the numbers from 3 or 4 years out, once these people are accustomed to having insurance and have been informed by er practitioners about when they need to see a doctor and when it is a legitimate emergency. It's possible that the numbers won't go down, but if I had to bet I would bet that 5 years out they will.
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  #6  
Old January 6th, 2014, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by trlrtrash13 View Post
So Obama lied in 2008
It's... SINCE 2008. Thus far every selling point about Obamacare droned on and on repeatedly for the last six years has been a lie.
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Old January 6th, 2014, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by trlrtrash13 View Post
But it is ok for others to speculate about the negative effects? If nobody can make reasonable speculations about what a law is designed to do, then wouldn't Pelosi have the right approach in saying we should just pass laws and see what happens?

The argument that there would be fewer er visits is a sensible one. That doesn't mean it is necessarily correct, but if everyone has insurance over time er visits should go down. A study that covers one year following uninsured people getting insurance isn't really the be all end all word on what the overall affect will be. It would be interesting to me to see the numbers from 3 or 4 years out, once these people are accustomed to having insurance and have been informed by er practitioners about when they need to see a doctor and when it is a legitimate emergency. It's possible that the numbers won't go down, but if I had to bet I would bet that 5 years out they will.
Pelosi didn't say we have to just pass laws and see what happens, she said we have to pass it to see what's in it. Besides, she is not the President and presumably..and quite obviously, doesn't have a staff who should be wise enough to advise when to keep your trap shut for fear that it will blow up in your face. If it's proven that ER visits do actually come down, which I seriously doubt, then that would be a good talking point for the POTUS and the dems, but if that doesn't happen then people will see it as a lie, reasonable deduction since he has already lied about keeping your plans and your doctors.
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Old January 6th, 2014, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Midnight Marauder View Post
It's... SINCE 2008. Thus far every selling point about Obamacare droned on and on repeatedly for the last six years has been a lie.
There are two major problems in calling this a lie.

1. In order for it to be a lie, you have to prove that it was incorrect. You can't do that right now. You can only prove that a study shows different results in a different situation in Oregon.

2. He had to have known it was a lie when he said it. This study came out in 2014. President Obama made these claims in 2008 and forward when he was selling the bill.

You know better than what you just said. Did he lie? Yes. But why trivialize the real lies by claiming it was all lies. How do you expect to win over a thinking person with thoughtless claims that are easily disproved?
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Old January 6th, 2014, 06:28 PM
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Obama lied, people died.

It's been coming out the last few months, that almost all of Obama's talking points used to sell this shit sandwich, he knew at the time they were not true. Starting with the one in my sig and continuing with the one from the OP.

These lies were not one time mistakes, they were repeated over and over and over and over again, for years, long after Obama knew they were wrong. That makes them lies.

Report just today - there are 6 million people right now without health insurance, than there were prior to the Obamacare launch.

I contend it's working exactly as intended on all fronts, to tell ya the truth.
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Old January 6th, 2014, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Midnight Marauder View Post
Obama lied, people died.

It's been coming out the last few months, that almost all of Obama's talking points used to sell this shit sandwich, he knew at the time they were not true. Starting with the one in my sig and continuing with the one from the OP.

These lies were not one time mistakes, they were repeated over and over and over and over again, for years, long after Obama knew they were wrong. That makes them lies.

Report just today - there are 6 million people right now without health insurance, than there were prior to the Obamacare launch.

I contend it's working exactly as intended on all fronts, to tell ya the truth.
I wholeheartedly agree that the one in your sig was a lie. However to call a prediction that was reasonable and most likely believed at the time a lie based on a study that comes out on a similar but still much different situation is wrong. Look at it this way. Let's say that when the actual numbers come that er visits go down, will you then say anyone who looked at this study and concludes that er visits will go up is a liar? If not, it is wrong to call Obama's projections on this matter a lie.
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